The Truth on How Much Protein You Really Need Per Day to Build Muscle
Welcome to the Fitness Revolution! If you are new here, you may want to see our top 9 reasons to subscribe. Thanks for stopping by!
How much protein do you REALLY need per day to build muscle? Chances are that you may be actually overeating. But how much is enough to help maintain and build muscle? Is there a limit per meal that the body can use? Lets get started with 2 more recent studies that currently have many high protein eating bodybuilding communities panicking…..
Six healthy young men reported to the laboratory on 5 separate occasions to perform an intense bout of leg-based resistance exercise. After exercise, participants consumed, in a randomized order, drinks containing 0, 5, 10, 20, or 40g whole egg protein. Protein synthesis and whole-body leucine oxidation were measured over 4 h after exercise by a primed constant infusion of leucine.
APS increased in a dose-dependent manner and also reached a plateau at 20g ingested protein. Leucine oxidation was significantly increased after 20 and 40g protein were ingested.
Ingestion of 20 g intact protein is sufficient to maximally stimulate MPS and APS after resistance exercise. Phosphorylation of candidate signaling proteins was not enhanced with any dose of protein ingested, which suggested that the stimulation of MPS after resistance exercise may be related to amino acid availability. Finally, dietary protein consumed after exercise in excess of the rate at which it can be incorporated into tissue protein stimulates irreversible oxidation.
and here’s another one
This study sought to compare changes in muscle protein synthesis and anabolic efficiency in response to a single moderate serving (113 g; 220 kcal; 30 g protein) or large serving (340 g; 660 kcal; 90 g protein) of 90% lean beef.
Mixed muscle fractional synthesis rate was calculated during a 3-hour postabsorptive period and for 5 hours after meal ingestion. A 113-g serving of lean beef increased muscle protein synthesis by approximately 50% in both young and older volunteers. Despite a threefold increase in protein and energy content, there was no further increase in protein synthesis after ingestion of 340 g lean beef in either age group. Ingestion of more than 30 g protein in a single meal does not further enhance the stimulation of muscle protein synthesis in young and elderly.
Source: A Moderate Serving of High-Quality Protein Maximally Stimulates Skeletal Muscle Protein Synthesis in Young and Elderly Subjects; Journal of the American Dietetic Association, Volume 109, Issue 9, Pages 1582-1586
So according to the research above we are seeing that muscle protein synthesis maxes out after a meal at 20-30 grams and anything in over will actually not help stimulate more muscle protein synthesis, but rather just increase excess oxidation (burn for energy).
More Protein Does Not Mean More Muscle
While protein is of course essential to building up muscle, that doesn’t necessarily mean that just eating more and more guarantees bigger muscles. So how much do we really need in the first place? Well here’s some numbers for you:
- The RDA (recommended dietary allowance) for protein is 0.8 grams per kilogram of body weight of adults (or roughly 0.36 grams per lb of body weight). Or I have also seen advised that women need at least 46 grams of protein per day, and men need at least 56 grams of protein per day (to avoid deficiency).
- NSCA (National Strength and Conditioning Association) recommends that for active people ,endurance and strength training, a higher intake is advised at around 0.4-0.6 per lb of bodyweight (and up to 0.8g/lb bw for full time athletes).
*Note that most of these “body weights” for calculating protein are more based on “ideal” (or even “fat free”) weight.
These are interesting numbers and much lower than what you may hear out there. You can see that with more activity, then the recommended amount of protein will increase. What is also important to remember that the overall calorie intake is also increasing with activity level. So in essence, while the amount of protein may increase the % of protein per daily calories may actually be the same (or less). Just something to keep in mind, as calories also matter.
Intermittent Fasting and Protein Intake
Well if you look at the info above where only 20-30grams of protein are absorbed per meal, then what about many of us IF’ers who eat less number of but larger meals? Are we going to lose all our muscle when we fast and only eat 2-3x a day? Of course by now many who IF already know that is not true.
But it does call into question about “needing” 5-6 meals of 20-30grams of protein to maximize muscle protein synthesis. As much as every supplement company would love us all to believe that we need a 20gram whey protein shake every 2-3 hours (and fuel more supplement sales), in fact maybe the body works better when presented a randomized/stressed environment and not some set equally divided schedule day in and out.
Here’s a little outtake from Dr Eades on his blog comments (#2 to be precise) about protein turnover and IF that is very enlightening:
I don’t think IF would affect muscle mass much at all. If you go without food for a long period of time, say, several days, your metabolic system goes after your muscle mass to convert the protein stored there into the glucose you need to keep your blood glucose normal. This doesn’t happen in the short term. All the protein structures in the body draw from and add to the amino acid pool. When muscle breaks down the individual amino acids go into the pool from where they’re harvested by the system that converts them to glucose. When new muscle is made, the amino acids used to construct the muscle protein are drawn from the amino acid pool. One of the contributors to the AA pool is enzymes that are no longer needed and junk proteins that the body is cleansing from the cells. When one is fasting, one of the group of enzymes not really needed is the group of digestive enzymes that would otherwise be employed in digesting food. These enzymes break down and their amino acids enter the AA pool where the muscle can pick them up as needed. Also, during an IF, the body goes into ketosis. I posted a few months back on how ketosis stimulates the process of cellular cleansing by removing junk proteins from the cells. The amino acids from these proteins also enter the AA pool where they can be recycled by the muscle mass. So, even though new protein isn’t coming into the body minute by minute from the diet, there is plenty of substrate there in the AA pool to last until the next meal, which is, at most, only 24 hours away.
So by the looks of it, actually not eating all day long may help increase you ability to build more muscle on less dietary protein. By using IF and allowing the body to recycle old junk proteins (remember autophagy?) as well as enzymes, the demand for amino acids through diet could be less.
Protein Pulsing for Better Anabolic Responses?
Here’s another interesting outlook on how the body is actually able to use proteins in a larger meal vs several spread out ones.
After a controlled period, 15 elderly women (mean age: 68 y) were fed for 14 d either a pulse diet (n = 7), providing 80% of the daily protein intake at 1200, or a spread diet (n = 8), in which the same daily protein intake was spread over 4 meals. Both diets provided 1.7 g protein•kg fat-free mass (FFM). Protein accretion and daily protein turnover were determined by using the nitrogen balance method and the end product method (ammonia and urea) after an oral dose of glycine. Nitrogen balance was more positive with the pulse than with the spread diet. Protein turnover rates were also higher with the pulse than with the spread diet, mainly because of higher protein synthesis in the pulse group than in the spread group.
Source: Protein pulse feeding improves protein retention in elderly women; American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, Vol. 69, No. 6, 1202-1208, June 1999
My favorite big meal of protein usually involves lots of juicy steak....what's yours?
So in this group it seems that when eating a “protein pulsing” style of having 80% of daily protein in one meal (and 20% later on), it actually increased nitrogen balance, protein turnover and protein synthesis…when compared to the equally spread out diet. In short…they became more anabolically responsive (for the muscle building nerds).
But to be fair, the same study was done on younger (mid 20s) women too, and this time the results were even between the pulse and spread diet. While there was no increases in the nitrogen balance or protein turnover/synthesis for the younger group, there was also no disadvantage from the pulsing pattern.
Lesson to be learned, eating protein in a pulsing style/larger meal (although through the studies up top would go against it) does not decrease the anabolic factors associated with muscle gain. In fact, as we get older and our anabolic sensitivities/responses start to decline (all downhill from 30 after all!), it may be more vital to use such strategies to help keep us more responsive (as the study for protein pulsing was initially done to try and help elderly people from losing muscle with age).
But Post Workout Protein Makes More Muscle … Right?
While eating protein is part of the building blocks for making more muscle, it is important to know that your body works in the long term and not minute by minute. With that in mind, how about the importance of the post workout shake (as we hear that eating right after a workout increases protein synthesis)? But that “microscience” ignores the overall bigger picture on whole body recovery that has us building muscle long after the “post workout” window. Here’s a study to help show that point:
Twenty healthy men were studied in the evening after consuming a standardized diet throughout the day. Subjects participated in a 2-h exercise session during which beverages containing both carbohydrate and a protein hydrolysate (C+P) or water only (W) were ingested.
During exercise, whole-body and muscle protein synthesis rates increased by 29 and 48% with protein and carbohydrate coingestion.
During subsequent overnight recovery, whole-body protein synthesis was 19% greater in the C+P group than in the W group. However, mean muscle protein synthesis rates during 9 h of overnight recovery did not differ between groups.
We conclude that, even in a fed state, protein and carbohydrate supplementation stimulates muscle protein synthesis during exercise. Ingestion of protein with carbohydrate during and immediately after exercise improves whole-body protein synthesis but does not further augment muscle protein synthesis rates during 9 h of subsequent overnight recovery.
Source: Coingestion of Carbohydrate and Protein Hydrolysate Stimulates Muscle Protein Synthesis during Exercise in Young Men, with No Further Increase during Subsequent Overnight Recovery; Journal of Nutrition, doi:10.3945/jn.108.092924
Confused? Well I’m going to let my buddy Brad Pilon and author of the new ebook “How Much Protein” answer that one:
What you are looking at is two different measurements of protein synthesis in the human body. “Whole body protein synthesis” is a measurement of the protein synthesis happening in your entire body. This includes things like your liver, heart, lungs, brain GI Track and your muscles. This measurement does not tell you WHICH part of your body the protein synthesis is happening in, just that it is happening. “Muscle protein synthesis” is specifically measuring the amount of protein synthesis that is happening IN your skeletal muscle.
So from the example you posted above, it is obvious that the post workout protein shake increased whole body protein synthesis, but did not increase skeletal muscle protein synthesis. Most likely this means that the extra protein increased protein synthesis in your liver and gastrointestinal tract, but had no measurable effect on your muscles.
So if the point of taking protein before, during, and after your workouts is to build muscle, then the research you quotes seems to say that there would be no additional muscle building effect.
You can skip all the money you spend on protein shakes/powder and just eat enough protein with real foods, as you don't need as much as you think you do.
When you have the right kind of recovery and still eat enough during the day, it seems the “hype” about the post workout window goes away. Honestly unless you are a hard training athlete who needs immediate glycogen replenishment to train again the next day, trying to intake protein (with carbs) during or right after a workout is not necessary.
If people are going to insist on something around workouts, then I would say only a small intake of BCAAs PRE-workout would be most the average person would need. Whether you eat or not immediately after a workout can be up to you, but I wouldn’t base it on some extra muscle building theory.
Higher Protein and Weight Loss
The other part of the equation when it comes to why you eat protein, is about your goals and how many calories you are intaking. Many people use the higher protein intakes when they are looking to lean out and minimize muscle loss. Protein being a harder macronutrient to convert to fat (than carbs or fat), makes it an easy choice to eat more of while keeping carbs/fat low.
Protein will also help you to feel fuller and less likely to overeat on any other macronutrient (fat/carbs). So even if you are intaking more than enough protein to maintain muscle, you are really doing it from another strategy that may include just trying to avoid excess calories and lean out.
Wrapping Up
- The amount of protein that you REALLY need to build muscle is lower than you think, but you still have to get in enough calories from some place.
- Most people using higher protein based diets are usually trying to lose weight and maintain muscle (by limiting calories from excess fat and carbs). As remember, calories matter when you are trying to lose weight.
- If your intake of carbs or fats is higher, then your need for protein (as a calorie source only) decreases. Also diets higher in carbs/fats tend to have more nitrogen sparing effect. The issue being making sure you are eating healthy (especially carbs) and not overdo it, as it could easily be stored as fat. This is why many just go the higher protein way, because of an easier route for body composition and they say “well I have to eat something…mine as well be more meat!”.
- The more active you are, the more protein you probably should intake. Most average active people only need about 0.6g/lb of lean body weight. On the high end I would say only need to go 0.8-1.0g/lb bw, but that does not guarantee extra muscle especially when you can up calories from fat/carbs.
- Using IF (intermittent fasting) is not going to make your muscle waste away, but will in fact actually utilize more internal sources for AA (amino acids) such as unused enzymes and junk proteins.
- Skip the protein shakes and eat real foods….as the additional vitamins, minerals, and essential fats also play a role in building more muscle (and burning fat too). This is also an advantage to knowing you need less protein than originally believed…because you can focus on quality of the source (pastured eggs, grass fed meats) rather than quantity. Which leads to more natural vitamins, minerals and essential fats (including less Omega 6s, more Omega 3s and even some others like CLA proven to help burn fat/build muscle).
- Unless you are needing immediate muscle glycogen replenishment for the next day of training (athletes), you don’t need that immediate post workout shake/meal.
- Bodybuilders telling you to eat 300+ grams protein a day and train 5x a week…..are only getting results due to the best genetics (much higher than average protein synthesis capabilities) the world has to offer…or a little help from anabolic hormones (steroids) to increase protein synthesis with that higher protein intake (and frequent workout schedule). The average person could not do much with that strategy (except just burnout).
- Seems that whether you eat in 2-3 bigger meals (and/or pulse 1 large meal), or 6 smaller meals…..it won’t matter for muscle building. In the long run, the results are the same as long as the total amount of protein is kept constant.
So there you go. Did it make you rethink how much protein you really need? I wish someone had this talk with me when I was around 16 because I could have saved $1000s over the next 10+ years from not buying all sorts of protein powders/shakes/bars. When it comes to muscle building, having enough protein matters of course….but the amount is smaller than most would think (especially when you can get enough calories in from carbs/fats and have adequate training + recovery).
More reading: If you want more studies to understand how much protein you really need, then I highly recommend Brad Pilon’s How Much Protein ebook, as it is one of the best straight forward and scientifically (and not bodybuilding hyped) based reads on protein out there.
Print This Post
What a comprehensive article, thanks guys!
Protein intake is such a passionate topic for many of us. The battle of getting your protein from whole foods versus the processed sugar-filled kind is one I have struggled with.
I have now found a protein shake that is derived 100% from natural sources, and I pack it with frozen berries and have it for an afternoon snack every day. The rest comes from the usual; eggs, baked beans, dairy, legumes, and of course anything with eyeballs (AKA meat)!
I also think a person’s metabolic type (Carb, mixed or protein) can dictate the percentage of total calories derived from protein. Being a carb type, if I eat too much protein I bloat up, feel tired and lack energy.
Thanks for the hard facts.
Amelia
[Reply]
[...] See the article here: The Truth on How Much Protein You Really Need Per Day to Build … [...]
This has been one of those questions I’ve spent time pondering. I believe there’s a lot of misinformation about how much is needed to build muscle. Thanks for providing this post.
[Reply]
Good article, a point for clarification though. In the section “More protein does not mean more muscle” you don’t use units in the NSCA recommendations — 0.4-0.6 of what? If grams, it is confusing because you’re using pounds in the other portion, mixing units. And using the mixed units of kgs in the RDA recommendations and pounds in the NSCA recommendations is confusing as well. If you were to do the conversion to keep the units consistent for the reader (perhaps providing the second set of units in brackets) it would be helpful.
Thanks!
[Reply]
Mike OD Reply:
@Greg – Definitely protein is something that may be “overhyped”, although total calories also play into the picture….high protein diets are usually low carb/fat but if one has enough calories from carbs/fat already then the need for protein is lower than what most probably think. Eating a bit more protein is just a security blanket for many and not really going to do too much harm body composition wise.
@Amelia – The protein pulsing study is interesting to note that if protein bogs you down, having only one bigger meal might be a better way to go if you feel you are not getting enough. Smaller amounts during the day otherwise probably won’t slow you down and will be more of your carb intake (plus you may also feel more sluggish with high starch + protein…so it may be a better plan for you with more carbs/starches in smaller meals and larger protein meal without starches). As for shakes I personally don’t do them because in 2-3 meals I can easily intake my total amount of protein for a day (and whole food takes longer to digest and breakdown, so you get more protein over longer periods of time)…..snacking would be more on nuts/trail mix type of thing. Also I like to make sure I get plenty of vit & minerals from the fatty parts of protein (egg yolks, grass fed meats, etc).
@MT – the second is g/lb of BW (which is what I use for the most part all the time). RDA is in kg but I’ll add in a conversion to clarify (as you just need to divide by 2.2 to get g/lb from g/kg).
[Reply]
[...] Higher Protein and Weight Loss The other part of the equation when it comes to why you eat protein, is about your goals and how many calories you are intaking. taken from here The Truth on How Much Protein You Really Need Per Day to Build Muscle – Fitness Spotlight : Fitness … [...]
I think that many people are uninformed about the appropriate protein consumption for themselves. At Studio Element, we attempt to convince and believe that our clients are usually able to ingest the correct amount of protein through their normal diets without supplementing.
[Reply]
Just like this topic says, protein depend of the amount of activity and the amount of the other macros, for example, if a person eat only protein like a PSMF DIET, then the need for protein will be higher that 1gr per LB, especially if that person is involved in weights or other workouts.
But if the person eats plenty of carbs or fats, then 1gr per lb of muscle or free fat mass its more than enough
[Reply]
Great article, I usually do well on 200 to 400 grams of protein a day. Most of this comes from whole foods. I like to supplement as needed or when I can’t get in a regular meal. I always prefer real food over protein drinks and I am very picky about what drinks I use. Generally speaking my protein requirements do depend on my activity level, typically I low carb, ride a mountain bike for an hour before work, at work I’m on my feet all day and then at the end of my day I spend an hour in the gym with a 1/2 hour on the bike again after my weight lifting. If I cut out the bike riding I have to lower my protein intake considerably or I start putting on fat. And of course since I low carb this makes a big difference in my calorie intake, as well as eating as lean and clean as I possibly can. But any way I thought I’d get my two cents in.
I always enjoy you articles, Thanks.
[Reply]
Awesome article.
I’ve always had a suspicion that you really don’t need 2-3x bodyweight in grams of protein a day (as many bodybuilders will have you believe.) Now I also do think that *if* you’re “juicing” you may be able to utilize more protein than if you’re “natural.”
People often times model their nutrition and workouts after people who are not “natural” and therefore get confused.
It’s good to hear a bit of logic, level headedness and science to the myth of protein overloading.
Thanks!
-Sean
[Reply]
Well said…
Protein powders and shakes should be used sparingly. Whole foods is where it’s at. Thanks for providing plenty of evidence by way of research studies.
Mike
[Reply]
[...] I came across a comprehensive article written by The Fitness Spotlight on Protein intake per day. If you are looking for some more detailed insights, read their article. It details techniques [...]
Great article. I like the research references and also the point that IF doesn’t cause muscle deterioration – something so many people will argue.
[Reply]
Mike OD Reply:
@Nikki – Agree. As I find that the more a person disagrees or argues about something, the less they really know about it in the first place. Once someone actually understands how things work, there is nothing left to argue over.
[Reply]
[...] – Josh Everett How Much Protein do you need to build Muscle? – Mike [...]
Your research is very poor, and the fact that you have compliments about your research is ridiculous, herd mentality, an expert said it so it has to be true thinking. Your first research study showed research on 6 males. 6?!! How can you draw conclusions from research on only 6 males?
Another conclusion you made of more and smaller meals, only showed results for 15 elderly women, and you still put it in your conclusion?!
It doesn’t seem like you know how to do research. It seems you were more interested in finding research that supported what ideas you had, instead of doing an objective review of studies to draw conclusions from. That’s not how you do research. I hope you revise this article to take out these studies and do an actual objective review of the research on these matters before you draw conclusions about them.
[Reply]
Mike OD Reply:
@Amir – Does the conclusions upset you because the research is not clear enough, or is it really just challenging everything you thought you know about eating in the first place? I used information that is not the same old BS found out there, as my mind is purely open and just looking for real facts (if you just wanted to hear the same old information that mainstream mindlessly promotes, then this is not the place). I don’t claim one way is the only way, as anyone that does is close-minded. But feel free to post any research you deem appropriate to the conversation. Otherwise you seem just like another bodybuilding-educated stereotype who is just reacting to anything that contradicts an eat all day in proportional meal mentality. Contribution to the conversation with other research (even if it goes against what is said here) is always a better approach if you want to make a valid point…otherwise your criticism is not constructive.
As for the study on elderly women, note that I also reference the same study done on younger women. There was no disadvantage (but not as big a positive difference) to the protein pulsing plan. As we age, our body better reacts to stressors since most of our natural processes start to decline. This is important for older people as losing muscle is a major concern and increased risk factor for health. Same is seen in studies with intermittent fasting groups, it deems more advantageous as we get older and our responses to small stressors are greater (as there are multitudes of IF studies all over this site, if you would like to investigate further).
[Reply]
Amir,
You do know that almost ALL studies on exercise physiology and nutrition are with 1.5g/lbs works best for you or whatever you take. Basically, whatever is working for you… you don’t need a study to tell you otherwise.
[Reply]
I’m not bodybuilding educated (although I have read some), nor do I work for a supplement company. I don’t claim to be a nutrition expert or know the actual truth to the different topics you addressed in your article. I probably disagree with you that the 4-5 meals a day is not better, but I probably agree with you about the supplements. Either way, what upset me were the conclusions you make were based on biased research. To use just one study done on 6 males and another one with 15 elderly woman and to title your article as “The Truth” and draw conclusions from those lacking studies, shows that you are not that competent in research and clearly biased towards your agenda, instead of looking for real facts. If you are actually looking for credibility and validity and truth as you say, you should do an objective review of the research done in the areas you are interested in. If the well researched unbiased answer on what to do/recommend isn’t clear, then unfortunately, that’s the answer, it’s not clear yet. It’s fun to go against the mainstream advice, but organizations, such as the World Health Organization, look at the entire body of research from various phd’s, journals, organizations, and universities before coming up with an answer to either recommend, not recommend, or conclude the answer isn’t clear yet.
[Reply]
Amir – Show me studies that you would like me to address on the subject and I will be happy to review and comment. Sure eating 6x a day with protein spread out CAN work (as you will never hear it said otherwise)….but to think it is the only way, is not accurate either. The study above illustrates one such alternative, but it not law by any means.
Here is an additional study on protein pulsing in older rats with similar results:
“In conclusion, the present paper provides evidence that age-related impairment of muscle protein turnover involved alterations of both protein synthesis and protein breakdown after meal ingestion. These alterations could play a role in the age-related loss of muscle protein and new studies are necessary to understand the causes of these alterations.
Moreover, the use of a pulse protein feeding pattern restored the stimulation of muscle protein synthesis during feeding in old rats. These results are complementary to data obtained in elderly humans showing a positive effect of the pulse protein feeding pattern on nitrogen balance (5Citation ). Other studies are required to optimize the conditions of the pulse protein feeding pattern (e.g., age at which the pulse protein feeding pattern should be implemented, at which meal, for how long). We anticipate that the pulse protein feeding pattern could also be useful to help the recovery of undernourished elderly patients.”
http://jn.nutrition.org/cgi/content/full/132/5/1002
and another reference to protein pulsing….
Protein turnover modifications induced by the protein feeding pattern still persist after the end of the diets; M. A. Arnal1, L. Mosoni1, Y. Boirie2,
This study was undertaken to determine whether the protein feeding pattern could induce chronic adaptation of protein turnover. After a 15-day adaptive period, elderly (68 yr) and young (26 yr) women received, for 14 days, a diet providing 200 KJ · kg fat-free mass (FFM)-1 · day-1, where the daily protein intake (1.7 g protein · kg FFM-1 · day-1) was either spread over 4 meals in the spread pattern or mainly (80%) consumed at noon in the pulse pattern. One day after the end of the dietary treatment, whole body leucine kinetics were measured by use of a continuous [13C]leucine infusion, both in the postabsorptive state and in the same fed state. The pulse pattern was able to induce, in young as in elderly women, a lower postabsorptive leucine oxidation and endogenous leucine flux than the spread pattern and improved the responsiveness of nonoxidative leucine disposal during 4-h oral feeding. Thus the pulse pattern was able to induce chronic regulation of protein metabolism in young as in elderly women.
[Reply]
I do not work in the nutrition field and don’t have the spare time to look through all the research on this topic. I do understand research though, and that’s why I had a problem with conclusions about the truth with your 6 males study, and 15 elderly woman study. I prefer to pay more attention to recommendations that look at the entire body of research from various phd’s, journals, organizations, and universities before coming up with an answer to either recommend, not recommend, or conclude the answer isn’t clear yet. I didn’t feel you did that (maybe there’s not enough research to even recommend an answer, but if so, at least that is an actual unbiased answer: We don’t know yet), it seemed your article was more about trying to find anything that supported your opinion. You are definitely entitled to your opinion though.
[Reply]
Mike OD Reply:
@Amir – I am biased towards a more “intermittent feeding/fasting” protocol, as I have found personal benefits form it (as well as many others) when compared to old eating patterns. Eating 6x a day also works (as proven by many who do it), but is not a very fun way to live without having food OCD IMO. I wish there was more “large scale” research on eating patterns when it comes to health and longevity, but unfortunately that is usually not the case especially when you deal with such things as protein pulsing, so test groups tend to be smaller. From an evolutionary standpoint, there was not some evenly proportioned eating pattern…you had times of good food (and larger protein intakes from successful hunting), and then tougher times of lower food availability (feast-famine).
There is much study on IF to show the potential for dramatic health improvements, and it is something that is gaining more steam in the research community as well (http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/81/1/69). Is there much research that needs to be done, of course…but unfortunately I can’t tell you when or even if it will be on a larger scale. Like people, research can also have a bias at what outcome can be had (what they are looking for).
Believe it or not I do applaud your effort to question everything you read, as that is the true way to find answers for yourself.
[Reply]
Thanks for your response. You are right in that there seems to be not enough large scale research on IF and not enough research about the other interesting topics you address in this article either. So unfortunately, the answer, for me at least, has to be we don’t have a conclusive answer right now. I disliked that your article was portrayed as a clear answer to these questions, but I do appreciate being able to think about what you suggested and moreso you getting people to question their supplement, consumption driven ways.
[Reply]
I like the idea not to eat so much protein. I want to be leaner and more muscular, but i dont have the time nor the money to eat 6 times and buy the supplements.
But. I’ve never seen anybody to get lean without strict high protein diet. Every bodybuilder (natural) prepares the same way. No fasting, no 3 meals, no 0.6g protein per bodypound.
You say nutrition doestn matter so much as we think or the magazines make us think, the working out doesnt matter so much (i mean its enough 3 times short resistance training to keep or build muscle.) Than tell me why isnt a lot of muscular guy or girl around.
I will give a try, but i am sceptic because i dont see real life proof.
[Reply]
Mike OD Reply:
@Woodslave – Getting “enough” protein is key, and will also depend on your activity level and calories from other sources. Sure most people eat high protein when trying to lose weight, but the real success is still by being in calorie deficit. Could you have more carbs/fat and lower the protein while still losing weight? Sure you can, as seen with other diets out there (Zone, South Beach). The high protein (lean) route just makes it “easier” to make sure you are getting enough protein while also not filling up on higher calorie foods (esp those with higher intakes of carbs/fats which most tend to over-eat on). But in the end, you just burn the excess protein as energy and are still successful because of calorie deficit. Magazines should not be the “go to” source for all things health and fitness, as most are owned by supplement companies (or rely on their advertising money). Not EVERY “natural” bodybuilder does the same thing….you just have to look outside what the mainstream promotes to see that. Strongmen and BB of the days of old ate 2-3 meals a day, didn’t use protein shakes and ate real foods (this is a great read on it all here). Also keep in mind those who are using 300-400g of protein a day with success are either A) not getting enough calories from fat/carbs in the first place and/or B) using hormonal enhancers (testosterone) to be able to use that high intake of protein. You don’t need 2x your BW protein to build muscle….but your calories from carbs/fat also play a role into whether you are building muscle/burning fat.
In the end the lesson is that sure 6x a day or high protein/low fat & carbs CAN work (as demonstrated by those who do it)….but it is NOT the only way. Complicated sells and is a great business model (supplements, bars, shakes, diet books) but simple works once you understand WHY and HOW things happen in the body. You will do fine with 3x a week real strength training (reps 5-10), some lower intensity activity other days (not HIIT, just walking or slow “cardio” pace for 20-40min) and eating 3 normal meals with “as high as” 1g/lb bw of protein (could you do less, yes but will also need to up calories from fat/carbs for energy, while still staying in calorie deficit overall).
Of course if you wanted even more information on why eating more doesn’t “speed up your metabolism”, the hormones involved in fat loss and why intermittent fasting does work….you can get the ebooks for FREE by clicking here for the IF Life and all that info.
[Reply]
[...] I came across a comprehensive article written by The Fitness Spotlight on Protein intake per day. If you are looking for some more detailed insights, read their article. It details techniques [...]
Thanks Mike.
But when I say “low” protein I mean 70-120 as Brad recommend in his book (didnt read yet, jut saw it on a forum post so maybe inaccurate).
The 1 gramm / body pound 2.2g / body kg (im from Europe is use metrik system) Is not low. An “average” gym rat ike me is near or above – depends on fat level – 200 pound and 200 gramm protein isnt far from the general recommendation for bodybuilders in magazins or in advertisements. (at least here dunno about usa). 200 gramm protein comes from 1 kg (2.2lb) chicken breast.
So what if i eat only 100 gramm protein. Like lean body mass * 0.7.-.08.
Can I keep or better build muscle mass? Can I build muscle when i fasting 2 day in a week?
Thank for Ur time.
[Reply]
Mike OD Reply:
@Woodslave – I’m getting a little confused on the kg/lb switching around (us Americans fear the metric system afterall)…but to answer your question simply, if your goal is muscle gain 0.8g-1.0g x lean lb bw is a safe range to aim for…..sure 0.6gxlb bw can work, but that means you also need enough carb/fat calories on target inorder to signal muscle growth (as you won’t with too low calories overall). Also by “aiming” for protein to be 0.8-1.0gxlb of lean bw you give yourself room for error (as some days you may aim for higher intake and still eat low as well). What can work….and the reality of how we eat, are usually not 100% the same. “Intermittent” Fasting (not extended for days) will not inhibit muscle growth, UNLESS you still don’t eat enough calories overall (which can be a result of too much fasting). Muscle growth is a simple equation of the right stimulus from weight training (by progressing with weights over time), the right stimulus from nutrition (to signal muscle repair/growth with calories) and letting your body rest/recover enough to let those 2 things happen.
[Reply]
1 more question and thanks in advance
I can train only in the morning at 6.30 am. 2 days a week on Thuesday anf Friday. I would like to have 2 fast days on monday and thursday. What do u recommend. Should I train completely fasted, (this means 24 hours) or should I eat something in the morning before workout?
What u recommend for fasting days? Eat a dinnner on sunday and fasting till monday dinner, or eat a breakfast on monday and fast till thuesday morning?
[Reply]
I ONLY notice great results and recovery when I consume a high protein diet.
[Reply]
[...] Do I eat enough (not just protein, but all calories)? How much is enough? Well most people can start at about 15-20x their lean mass (lbs) in calories and go from there. If you want to know how much protein you really need, then read this past article. [...]
[...] Do I eat enough (not just protein, but all calories)? How much is enough? Well most people can start at about 15-20x their lean mass (lbs) in calories and go from there. If you want to know how much protein you really need, then read this past article. [...]
a gram of protein per day for every pound you weigh. 200 lbs. = 200 gr.
yes the more u get from solid high protein food is better but a protein blend with 25 g before the gym and another 50g after the gym. between food and shakes you come up with another 125 gr to get into our body.
now stop the BS and suck up some whey and grab your gear !!!!
[Reply]
Robert C. Morreale Reply:
exactly… GIT-R-DONE!
[Reply]
This article is without a doubt the most comprehensive advice and has good fact value on the subject of protein. I have spent way too much time reading all the great comments! I have to agree that protein that is taken from real food sources is far more satisfying than just drinking protein shakes. I started out eating high amounts of protein when I went to a very low carb diet to drop the excessive weight I needed to lose. However, after I lost all the weight I included good complex carbs along with my protein meals. I generally eat 75% protein to just 25% complex carbs and i find that it balances my lean muscle to my weight. I take into account my age, body weight and level of exercise and weight training schedule. I am 53 years old and find that when I eat over 80grams of protein daily that I actually gain weight.
[Reply]
This area has been a struggle for me. I tried all kinds of protein diets. Now I stay away from the “protein shakes loaded with sugar” and I stick with the natural stuff.
[Reply]